You know, I would talk to those boys, and as often as not there would be no parking at all on the first date or two, and one of them, he was married, I guess he’d been married for four or five years, he got his girl pregnant in high school and they had to get married, and I must have seen him a dozen times or more, and he never so much as kissed me. He never even tried to. I would have kissed him, or just about anything, I guess, if he’d wanted, but he just liked to go for long rides with me and talk to me. We would talk about his wife and how they weren’t getting along so good, and how he was a fool to get married so young and be all locked up with a wife and kids. I guess he needed me for someone to talk to about these things.
GORDON: He must have wanted to have sex with you.
JUNE: I suppose he wanted it, I suppose he had sexual feelings for me, but he never even tried to do anything about them. He could have done something about it but he never tried. As a matter of fact he would let things drop from time to time about how if he were free he would really be interested in me, but he never took it any further than that.
But what I was getting at is that it wasn’t just sex all the time, but when I think back on that time it seems that way to me, as though that was all I did and all I thought about. It wasn’t, really. You know how it is? As though — remembering it — the sex part is in color and the rest of it, what I did from day to day, is in black and white. That’s the only way I can think to explain it.
RITA: But you were a virgin.
JUNE: I know.
RITA: That’s what is really strange about it.
JUNE: Yes, it is. I guess even then I was saving myself for Gordon.
RITA: Oh, how in the world can you say that? I mean how could you think of it that way at the time?
JUNE: I didn’t think of it but that is what I was doing.
RITA: You didn’t think this would happen, with the three of us.
JUNE: I may have known it inside, without knowing what I knew. Or I may have wanted it inside.
But all this time I was having sex and not having it. The one important thing was staying a virgin. I would I go with these boys — you have to call them men, they were all ages from twenty-five to thirty-five. And I would do anything but go all the way. Anything but let them put it inside of me. That was the one thing I refused to do under any circumstances, and I never did do it.
GORDON: Didn’t you ever want to?
JUNE: No.
GORDON: You must have gotten excited—
JUNE: It wasn’t that kind of being excited. I would feel in two parts when I was with a boy, part of me acting and part of me sitting across the room watching, sort of not attached to what was happening. I was excited, but not the way I am now. It wasn’t complete.
RITA: You would have orgasms.
JUNE: Once in a while. But it was not the same, it was not complete.
And what I generally did, it wasn’t so much a case of my getting excited. I would get excited in my mind more than my body because of what it was that we did. I mean, they might pet me some, but mostly it was what I would do for them...
I don’t know exactly how to say this...
Well, before this time I really didn’t know much about sex. I simply didn’t know very much, I was ignorant. And one boy finally had to explain to me that it was different for a man, that you couldn’t just expect them to stop, that a man has to have release when he’s excited or it’s physically bad for him. Frustrating. I didn’t know but that this might just be a line—
GORDON: No, it’s the truth. But nine times out of ten a man will say it as much for a line as anything else.
JUNE: Well, I decided it must be true, but at the same time I said that this was something I wasn’t going to do, to go all the way. I made this very clear. I put it right on the line, that I wasn’t going to do this and that was all there was to it, that I wouldn’t do it. The boy I first had this all out with, he was married, so he couldn’t try to convince me by giving me a big thing about loving me and how he would marry me if anything happened. He couldn’t say that because we both knew better and knew that there was no love involved, that we were both of us there for the pleasure of it, and for the company.
GORDON: Did it bother you, that he was married?
JUNE: It never bothered me at all.
GORDON: That’s what you told me before, but it’s just hard to believe.
JUNE: I never counted, but I think there was a lot more married than not. Especially the ones I would see again and again, they were for the most part married. When they weren’t married either they got tired of me because of not being willing to go all the way, or I lost interest in them. Because I didn’t want anything that would lead to me getting married to somebody, I suppose. I don’t know as I thought of it that way at the time, except that I would look at one of these fellows and I would say, now, do I want to marry this particular boy? And the answer was always that I didn’t.
When they were married it was safe, see. They didn’t want to leave their wives and I didn’t want them to, so it was safe.
This man I was talking about, that was married... this was another reason I believed him about being frustrated and having to have a release. Because he was married.
Anyway, he came right back and said that there was something I could do without going all the way. Now this was something I honestly knew nothing about. It’s hard to believe how ignorant I was in this subject.
RITA: It certainly is.
JUNE: I thought anything I might do would just make it worse. But he showed me what to do. He opened his pants and showed me how to handle his penis in a certain way. I really didn’t know what I was doing — I mean I didn’t know how to go about it or anything, but I would pay attention to what excited him and what didn’t, and he got very excited, and I was sort of excited by his excitement, if that makes any sense, and then he had an orgasm. As a matter of fact he came all over my blouse. He offered to pay for having it cleaned but I told him not to be silly and I just took and washed it myself after I got home.
After that I wouldn’t see him too often, but when I did it would always be the same. We would drive to a good place to park and then he would undress me and play with me. Once I knew that I could trust him I would take off all my clothes because I knew he wouldn’t try to force me. He would touch me, my breasts and elsewhere, and then I would jerk him off, pardon the expression.
You know, I liked that part better than being touched. That other was more for his benefit than for mine because it excited him tremendously to touch me and finger me. I think it excited him especially that I was a virgin. He would keep talking about it, touching me and saying that no one had ever been inside me, as though this was something special. I let him do this and I won’t say I didn’t like it—
RITA: No one would believe you if you did.
JUNE: But no, the other part was what I really enjoyed. Making him have an orgasm. Getting him all excited and then giving him a climax.
We tried some other ways, too. Like one time he put himself between my breasts and moved back and forth that way until he had an orgasm. Or against my leg. But I didn’t enjoy this as much as just having him sit there while I did it for him with my hands. I guess he didn’t, either, because he just wanted to do it the one time and then didn’t want to again.
I was dating other boys, too, and I started doing the same with them as well. They didn’t even have to ask. I would go on and touch the front of their pants, and usually they would be hard by this time from the petting, and some of them would right away open their pants and others wouldn’t, so I would touch them some more and then open their pants and reach inside. I remember a boy said he really couldn’t figure me out, that I was so aggressive about going for his penis but that I still drew a line about having intercourse. “That’s the way I am,” I said, “and you may take me or leave me.”